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Say it Sister...
Lucy and Karen, two 40-somethings, are always chatting about life, and all that it has to throw at them, and now want to share their raw, honest conversations with you. Their journey of finding their own voices, self-discovery and healing is something many of us can relate to. We all possess a unique power within us, but life’s trials often knock us off course. They have the tools, the courage to speak up and simply say it as it is, so you might feel seen, and understood and gain practical tools and techniques for self-discovery and personal growth during the changes we experience.
Say it Sister...
Rochelle Trow: What If Success Means Loving The Girl In The Mirror
What if the life that proves you “made it” is the very thing keeping you from yourself? We sit down with Rochelle Trow, founder of The Change Canvas and author of Awakening to Wholeness, A Life Unmasked to trace her journey from global HR executive to values-led leadership coach. This is a story about the cost of chasing success that shines on paper but starves the soul, and the radical clarity that follows when you stop overriding your body and start telling the truth.
Rochelle opens up about the mirror moment that revealed her burnout, and the deeper question that changed everything: Who am I without the labels?
We map her “freedom to shine” plan: ending a misaligned marriage, stepping away from a title-driven career, rebuilding trust at home, and healing her body from the inside out. As her inner world aligned, the weight of stress lifted—on the scale and in her spirit. The takeaway is practical and hopeful: redefine success on your terms, create boundaries that honour your values, and trade perfection for presence. Whether you’re in HR, leading teams, or simply ready to unmask, you’ll leave with tools to regulate under pressure, meet triggers with care, and make choices your nervous system can support.
If this conversation moved you or made you feel seen, follow the show, share it with a sister, and leave a review. Your voice helps more women unmask, lead with heart, and live in true alignment.
Rochelle Trow | Memoir & Personal Growth Books
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Messy, the magical, and everything in between. We call the puns, hate to views, stigmas, stereotypes, and lies that keep us stuck so that we can rise and reign like queens. We open up spaces and deepen relationships that bring us closer to love and a better world for all. So get comfy, grab your favourite drink, and let's say it sister.
SPEAKER_03:Welcome, listeners, to another amazing Say It Sister podcast. Our space is here for truth telling, self-leadership, and women redefining power from the inside out. Today we want to talk about the true meaning of success, such an amazing and important conversation for us as women leaders to be having how success can look perfect on the outside but feel hollow and empty inside. And what happens when our outer success outpaces our inner truth, how coming home to ourselves changes everything. And I've just got goosebumps running all the way up my arms as I'm saying these words. I'm having a bit of a body takeover, and actually it's going up into my neck and around the back of my head. Um, so I'm just sharing that. Like my body's something's major's going on on the inside of me. So I feel like this episode's going to be revolutionary in some way because I don't normally get that um that prompt so early on in a conversation. So yes.
SPEAKER_01:High expectations then. Well um, yeah, we will hold you in this space and whatever comes up, comes up. And so I just want to introduce our guest. Um, it's Michelle Trowe, founder of The Change Canvas, a leadership development and coaching practice, helping purpose-driven professionals and organizations to transform from the inside out. Now she has 25 years of international HR experience um with companies like Unilever, GSK, you know, the big ones, and she's led major transformation and cultural shift um programmes across global teams. After her own turning point, which I'm really intrigued to hear about, um, when she felt that her outer success no longer really matched her inner truth, she shifted her whole focus completely towards values-led conscious leadership. So through the change canvas and author of Awakening to Wholeness, A Life Unmasked, Rochelle now helps leaders cultivate self-awareness, regulate under pressure, and we talk a lot about that, don't we? And lead with alignment rather than fear. So good morning to you, Rochelle. How are you today?
SPEAKER_02:Good morning, Lucy and Karen. So wonderful to be on the podcast and to just talk. You know, talking is the way in which we share our stories and make a difference. And so I'm I feel touched that Karen had these goosebumps and I'm excited about having this conversation with you, you know, having published a book. I don't know what else I could say, except I think this is a vehicle where I could share some of the insights that I shared in my course through this conversation. So thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, very welcome. And so why don't you get into the story and tell us a little bit about you and what got you to this point? You've mentioned a turning point, um, and we know that those turning points never just arrive, they're they happen in little signals and little moments until you get that complete awareness. So just give us the the five-minute story to that turning point.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, well, I'd start with in the past, if somebody asked me who was I, I would go, Rochelle Trow, mother, wife, executive, and list all the roles and labels. And at a point in about five years ago almost, I read a book called The Untethered Soul. And in that book, he asks the question, Who am I? And I really couldn't answer that question. And so that question is what really was kind of, I would say, the tipping point as to who am I? Because when I looked in the mirror, I was like, who is this person? I don't recognize her. Firstly, I was 30 kilograms heavier than what I was as the 30-year-old that left South Africa. I was now in Switzerland after spending 20 years in the UK, and I looked at this woman and I'm like, she's got fat cheeks. I hate the look of, I hate the look of me. I don't recognize myself. I feel like I'm an autopilot. I feel like I'm just spinning in this treadmill, this uh, you know, the hamster wheel. I'm spinning in the hamster wheel. My head doesn't shut up, it just keeps going. My body is just this balloon. I'm stuffed in the suit. I'm like, yeah, going to a corporate job, I'm wearing a suit, but I'm now wearing dark colors. You know, black suits, but any color that would hide the fact was on my body, the bulging cheeks. And I was going, what am I doing? I going to work every day. And the reason why I joined HR back in South Africa, all those 25 plus years ago, was because I loved the part of HR that was about developing and growing and nurturing and leading people and identifying talent. And of late in my executive HR roles, all I did was restructure after restructure. And then as part-time because I loved the development side, and I know in my last job before I burnt out, I did over 200 career conversations because it was COVID. So, but there was a cost to doing that. The cost was I was doing the day job of restructuring the stuff I didn't like, the day job of managing the politics. You know, because you spend most of your time managing politics as opposed to doing a real job. All I was doing was doing one restrop restructure after the other. And the part of the job that I loved, I was doing in my spare time. And so really the cost of that was that the parts of HR I loved, I was doing, but I was doing it at a cost to me. So going back to my mirror moment and the big question, who am I? I didn't recognize myself. I had all the markers of success. I was senior HR executive, multiple houses in multiple countries, living in Switzerland, a house in South Africa, two houses in the UK, fat bank balance. But I was like, what's the point?
SPEAKER_03:And I yeah, I am desperate to say something because before you started speaking, I was thinking about the role of HR and how it's actually a soulful job. The word soulful came up really strongly for me. But what I often see is the soulless element of what HR executives are forced to do. You know, in and that for me fills me with always fills me with this feeling of like, oh, the point is being missed here. Because no one would go into a job or a career, and I know a lot of HR people, and so does Lucy through the work that we do. And the support that they also need is unbelievable and yet often so ignored and forgotten about. So I see it as something that's hugely soulful, but actually it becomes very soulless unless the companies um really consider the impact of HR and really what the job is there to do. So I just wanted to sort of say that because as you were talking, I was it was getting stronger and stronger and stronger. And um there needs to be so much evolution and revolution within within that department of HR because I don't believe it's being used in the right way.
SPEAKER_02:You know, well, firstly, thank you for acknowledging that. As an HR professional, it warms my heart that you say that because we are one of the understated functions, the least resource, overworked, and everybody's trying to do their best. And we so often get criticized as an HR function, we're focusing on the wrong things, but we humans, yeah, we come to work as ourselves, you know. So, in the time when I was having this crisis of who am I and hating my body, I was a mother of twins. We had just moved to a new country. I I realized my marriage wasn't working, it was COVID, we were restructuring, letting hundreds of people go during COVID. And there I was. And each day I went to work, I was being triggered by behavior, and I I literally burnt out, is the only way to say it. I was forced to stop. And so who am I? I was this person that had all these things. Everybody admired myself and my ex-husband, and thought, oh, this is a powerful couple, they have everything, but it just kept going, and I felt empty, exhausted, and just started to be, if I'm being honest, resent my husband for many reasons, but the resentment started to creep up and I and a and a point at which pushed me over the edge and sent me into burnout, and I'll stop was I had a meeting with somebody. Obviously, I can't share the details, but the person basically asked me to make some headcount savings. Now the context for these headcount savings is we had just finished a restructure. We just I just built my team and I was being asked to restructure my team not for any good reason, but because we needed to free up capacity to find something new that was being created, which I didn't believe in because I felt it was just an added layer. I had my strong opinions, and I I just I couldn't do it in a conversation with my coach. My coach said to me, Well, you can't keep going on like this. What are you gonna do? And I looked at her and I and I burst into tears. Me. This is this hard ass, hard-nosed South African that doesn't it wasn't even in touch with the emotion, started crying. I don't cry, but I was crying and I couldn't explain why I was crying. And then she turned around and said to me, Okay, let's be trolls, you, me, and I'm you. What would you be saying to the person in front of you? And I said, Well, I'd be telling the person you burnt out, go to the doctor and get a diagnosis. And she looked at me, she said, So let's switch again. What are you gonna do now? And I looked at her and I said, I'm gonna do exactly that. And for the first time in my career, I'm gonna take my own advice, which I've never done. But the reality was when I went to the doctor an hour later, I was booked off for a month with stress and referred to a psychiatrist.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So I needed it.
SPEAKER_02:So I was like that's me.
SPEAKER_01:We talk about this all the time, how the body will give you all the information you need, but we just keep ignoring it, ignoring it until that moment where you can't deny it anymore, or somebody comes and taps you on the shoulder and says, I don't think you're okay. And for you, it was like this gush of um these tears. And having done restructures many times myself, um, they are the hardest thing to do because you know you are absolutely making decisions over other people's lives that might be for some liberating, but for the others absolutely devastating. So I get it, I understand it. I've I never got to burn it out because I actually managed to save the headcount cost by making myself redundant and saving the 20% opex, and that's what gave me the chance to move on. Because again, I just could not do another restructure because it just became the way of things like oh new CEO or new idea, we'll have a restructure. And it just the the toll on people is just huge. So just acknowledging that, I I get it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it was it was tough, but hey, it was a gift, and and it's also learning to fall in love with you.
SPEAKER_03:That's what I'm hearing. So I do a lot of mirror work with women, it's one of the things I also do with myself. I've also done it with my six-year-old daughter. Um, and it is so incredibly powerful because when we actually do look at ourselves fully and we look past the hair colour, the skin colour, I wear glasses, I'm wearing this today. When we get past all of that, and we listen to some of the negative things we're saying about ourselves, and we get past that, and then we get into who we are. My voice is getting tight. This is very important, is what it's telling me. We see who we really, really are, and you looked in that mirror and you didn't see yourself, but then, and I'm getting my body's going crazy today, and then you did the process that you call it unmasking, which I love, and you started to take all that stuff off, and then you got into who you were, your fundamental core essence, and that's when you became soulful again. And I know there's more to this story, but I I just love that, and I and I want to bring it, you know, out to our listeners because many women will be listening to this and and in exactly the same situation that you are in, and will be thinking, I don't know how to get out of this. And you have lived through that experience, and so thank you for sharing, you know, so openly how hard it was.
SPEAKER_02:Oh well, I mean, talk about looking at yourself. I couldn't even look in the mirror and say, I love you. I could not say those three words to myself. Each time I tried to say it, I would break down in tears. So my body, this this emotional part of me that I never developed, my emotional side was completely underdeveloped because as a kid, I learned to self-soothe and block emotion. Yeah, so this was completely new. So in my book, I talk about stuff. I mean, I'm like crying, but it's so emotional, it's so not me. Anybody who knows me would go, really?
SPEAKER_01:Is that how old you let's say old you now you're full of it.
SPEAKER_02:Zero emotion, and you know, and I had to learn, I had to start by learning to love myself, Karen. So to go back to how did I unmask started simple compassion, compassion for me and accepting that yes, I I lived in these old beliefs, and and starting to be compassionate towards myself enabled me to love myself. But that took my journey took four years. Yeah, wasn't easy, lots of stop starts. Yeah, and when you're on a breakdown, not mental, but crying, for me, that's a big breakdown, emotional.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and it and when you're on a healing journey, because all those parts of yourself needed to be healed so that you could step into the woman you are today. And when we go on these journeys, it can take years and years and years and years. And I've personally been on like seven-year healing journeys and thought, oh my god, there's no end to this. I'm never ever going to um find myself in a position where I feel fully compact in a way. Um, and it's just taken forever. But actually, each part of that journey has taken me somewhere really important and opened up different doors and connected me with different people, and you know, then I teach it to pe to women, and it was worth every single moment, minute, day, hour, year, because this is what the world needs. You know, we need we need we need you, we need Lucy, we need me, and we need us to be able to go, yeah. I've done the work and it has been tough, but you know what? It's worth it.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01:And I agree with the seven years. I always find every seven years like, oh, okay, we I'm done with that bit. And what's coming in these seven years? Because I know it's always going to be like another journey, but um, yeah, I I just wanted to mark that because it does you you said like it took you four years. The completion might be around the seven years.
SPEAKER_02:Oh no, it's not done. It's not done. You know, actually, it took me four years to get to the point of writing the book.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:In itself was part of it, was part of my journey. I'm still now continuing because I'm still encountering new things, new experiences. And I'm still growing, I'm still evolving, and that fear keeps creeping up, and those triggers keep creeping up. They never disappear. You can imagine. I mean, my earliest self-belief was when I was two years old, under two years old, I should say. I developed that strong sense of independence and feeling abandoned as a baby. That goes so deep. It's taken so much healing in order to even get that out, but it still triggers me.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:It never goes away. So you're never gonna get rid of it, but you learn how to deal with it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And it's learning how to deal with it as the woman you are now today, you know? So you can you pick that lit little child up and you you give her love and you give her affection and you tell her it's gonna be okay and that she's loved. And that's how we do it, because those little parts of ourselves didn't know what they needed, they just felt something. And it's quite amazing for me because the world doesn't want us to be healed, but it also doesn't want us to be uh emotional, and so there's this absolute cross-purpose that we have to live. You know, it's like, oh no, don't go there, don't let those emotions out. You know, these are not permitted, so then we stuff, stuff, stuff, stuff, and at the same time, then we start to do the healing work, and it's like, well, don't do that either, you know, that's really messy. And inside there's all these parts of us that just say, please love me, please love me, because I'm amazing and I deserve love. And that is what I'm hearing from you. It's like, it's just so beautiful. Like you're going back to the two-year-old and you're saying, I've got you. You are perfect as you are, and I love you.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that's exactly it. Because at the end of the day, you know, we all come into this world. You know, you look at a kid, everybody we compare how kids behave. Kid comes into this world only needing love and safety. That's all they need. And what happens to us? We grow up and we lose all of that, we lose all the creativity, and you know, because we in this world and all these societal norms and expectations and things that people label us as. You know, I grew up in apartheid, South Africa, so I've I've been labeled. Yeah, you know, I've been labeled, I've got a few war stories where, you know, and it created self-belief, self-beliefs, I would say that protected me, but I had to unlearn them because they protected me in the wrong way. You know, so that that's how I became this person that was wearing a mask was because of old narratives that they served their purpose, they protected me. But in order to be truly me, I had to let go of them and put them into perspective.
SPEAKER_01:And something that you said earlier is about um about these measures of success that you had, you know, I had the job, I had the the kids, the houses, the bloody blah de blah. And I've shared many times on um the this pod about me blowing up my life um in my 30s, because the the version of success that I've been sold wasn't the version of success that was making me happy. So now you're you've been through this process and you've blown up your life, um, and now you're on a new path. What's your version of success now?
SPEAKER_02:Well, for now, if I go back to the Michael Singer, Who Am I in the past? I would have been a role, I would have had a whole lot of labels now. I'm just Rochelle.
unknown:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:I'm just an observer of my life, experiencing this amazing planet and learning how to flow with it. I'm not trying to control anything, I'm just flowing in the moment and living. And why? Because that feels so much more me. It feels so much more real. Because when all the stuff I learned was about control and holding and over-protection, you know, even the way I love my kids. I was in, I was loving my kids like my mother loved me, but in a different form. You know, she was so controlling. I was loving them in a controlling way, also. It was just different, it was over-protective, doing everything for them. So we learn all of these things. And so now I'm just rachile. Take me as I am, with all my flaws, with my no fingernails. I still have stumpy nails, I still bite my nails. That's one way to lose. I am who I am. That's it. That's me. And I am just flowing. So for me, my version of success now is can I cope with the craziness of life? Whether we like it or not, life is not simple. You know, I was listening to Brene Brown's book, uh Ground Strong or Strong Ground. And she talks about paradox. Almost everything in life is a paradox. There's the light side and the dark side. You know, so in my book, a key theme in my book was about the paradox of love. Literally about the paradox of love, the dark side of love and the light side of love. And I looked at that through a number of lenses. I looked at it through my relationship with my husband, the relationship with work, my relationship with my friends and family, my relationship with my kids. And I looked at it and I realized where I had become the person I didn't really want. I lost the child who had these dreams of writing a book and you know, I loved reading because that back then it was a protective mechanism to protect myself from the noise of my alcoholic brothers who were drunk and performing, and you know, I didn't grow up in the pretty neighborhood or background. So it was a protective force. But I lost it. So now I've just done full circle to my two-year-old and five-year-old self.
SPEAKER_03:And it is that it's the things that we do. So we think if we create this, then we'll be safe, you know, if if we get the house and the picket fence and we do all these things, then we'll be safe. And then, and actually we'll be happy. But if we are not connected to ourselves, we are still lost in some sort of other world and we're not fully there in ourselves. And that is impossible. And I remember going to one, you know, going to some training thing one time, it was a week-long thing. And when I got triggered, I was like, I am lost, I do not know who I am. And that was a the beginning of something different for me because I realized that I was inside. I didn't need to go on a retreat to find myself. I just needed to come in and be in here, you know, and hold space. And and some of it, there's something about what you're talking about around being okay with the unknown, not needing to box it all out, not needing to put it in places, but just be like, I don't know what, I don't know what's out there, I don't know what is gonna happen in two weeks' time. I don't know how this book's gonna unfold. I don't know, but I'm here in myself and I and I am inhabiting myself, and I think that's a journey every single woman has to do if we are going to be fully um successful, and that inner version of success of being like, for me, it's like for me to know that I'm okay and that I for me to be present and for me to be wholehearted and enjoy the moments of my life every single day. I might not do that for every every single moment, but every day I want to have these connection points. That's success for me, and everything else can fall around that. Um, because I spent a lot of my life not doing that, you know. So I've got the before, I've got the now.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, absolutely. And you know, we will never be able to control the world. Can we control the politics? No. Can we control the economic situation? No. So am I gonna lose sleep over worrying about stuff that I have zero control over? No. Yes, of course, it affects me, and I've got to be prudent, and yes, I've got to earn income, and yes, I've got to do these things, but I am I am not gonna let it be the center of my life. You know, so my definition of success, Lucy, is completely changed. In the past, it was about having money, having houses, having stability, being able to leave something, a legacy for my children, because you know, I come from humble beginnings and I don't get anything from my parents who have now left this planet, you know. But that was I thought was success. Now I don't care. For me, what's important is that my kids are fed, they're educated, and they can stand on their own two feet. So all that wealth of having all this money to leave, no. I am going to live life, enjoy it, educate them, and that's it. I'm not going to do sacrifice myself because I was the key breadwinner in the family. And and part of my struggle with my exes was a big narcissist. And I was just the engine to the lifestyle as opposed to really being valued. And I did everything. Not only did I have the lead career, I was the lead mother, I was the lead manager, the nanny, I was the lead everything. I was the one who was on aeroplanes every second week. I was the one managing the house from on a phone. You know, I was the one who had to say to my kids, who's crying, can you come home? And explain to my five-year-old that I'm in a different time zone. I mean, how heartbreaking is that? I'm I was the person who missed my kids' first steps. So to do so much for a marriage and get nothing back in return is it was heartbreaking. So, you know, I had to face into so much. But also in that process, the joy is that I let go of all those definitions of success because I'm okay earning significantly less money. But my kids are experiencing me so different. They're teenagers, they're incredible, they're wonderful boys. So it's not about money anymore, it's about love.
SPEAKER_01:I have to say that what after my divorce, um well, my my leaving my career um happened about a year after I left my marriage. And I always say that since that moment when I was earning ridiculous amounts of money and bonuses and had the car and you know, all of those things thrown in. Actually, after that, that was when I actually felt the richest I ever felt and the wealthiest because I measured it very differently. And equally, I've just been liberating. I've actually sold my house as well, so I don't even have an asset to leave my children behind because actually what I valued was freedom. Um, and that really, and it still matters to me the most now that if I want to be able to pick up and leave any time, I can because I haven't been in that position. So the things that make me rich and wealthy are the things that actually money can't buy, and that is that realisation for me. And that when I say that I'm richer now, it's also because my um I was the breadwinner, but my ex-husband still is, was then awful with money. So I've been like, how can I be earning half of what I am before, but actually have more money in my bank account? Well, I know the answer.
SPEAKER_02:Exactly. You know, it's so funny you say that because my motto through all of this was freedom to shine. I was I was clear. I mean, through my breakdown, I had a therapist, I had a coach. Fortunately, I had a coach in my executive role. And I said to my coach, said, Okay, so you know, we did some visioning, what are the things you're gonna do? I said, it was simple. Freedom to shine because freedom is what I want. And I'm gonna do four things. One, deal with my husband. Ask for a divorce. And I'm not gonna do it in one year, that's why it's four years. Two, deal with my job because I cannot, I am not my job. I cannot be solely linked to my job. I am somebody. Who am I? Who's this person? Three, I needed to rebuild the relationship with my twins. Okay. I needed them to see me as the mother, not this person that their father said, She's blowing up our lives. She wants a divorce.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:She has the problem. It's not me. And four, I had to deal with my personal. 30 kilograms. Okay, you've seen the 30 kilogram lighter version because literally, literally, the weight fell off me. But only fell off when I dealt with all my head stuff. Because your body doesn't heal unless you've done the journey and the path. So by the time I did in year four, it took me seven months. All I did was change my eating. I didn't go in an exercise craze or anything. I didn't go in a diet. I changed my eating. I became fully plant-based. The weight fell off in seven months. 30 kilograms.
SPEAKER_03:Wow. And it's like, it sounds to me like you had a different type of hunger. That's what I'm hearing. It's like, you know, there's a question that I love to ask, and it's like, what are you really hungry for? Like, what is that thing inside you that is just like we may be doing the habits on the outside, but is that really what you're hungry for? And it just opens up space. And I hear you talking about that. You're like, you were hungry for yourself. You were hungry for what you knew was right for you. And you wanted to be in relationships, deep relationships. Simple. You know, it sounds so simple, doesn't it? And yet we build up all this clutter and all these like layers around us and the masks, you know, and we're kind of walking around, and we're so like, you know, it's like so stiff in the body. And like one of our questions is, you know, well, you're talking about liberation actually. What happened to your body? I would like to know it the other side round, you know, like what's the feeling of liberation in your body?
SPEAKER_02:The feeling of liberation for me is I'm experiencing life differently. You know, at the point, if you go before the moment of my mirror moment, I didn't even smile. I couldn't smile. We'd go somewhere, we'd be driving. I mean, I've traveled to the most amazing places in this world. I'm well traveled. I stopped seeing the beauty of life. I was so focused, so task-driven, so living off in my phone calendar, literally ticking boxes. I miss the beauty of life. So moving to Switzerland was both the point at which I burnt out, but also transformation in that when I started to heal, I started to see life again. So for me, it's about just loving what we have in front of us. I've got so much to be grateful for all the experiences, you know. So don't get me wrong, my crazy corporate life was there to teach me. Was I perfect in that corporate life? No. In fact, I can now when I look back at my old version of myself, I'm going, now I know why people didn't connect with me because I was so task-focused. I was this executive, I wasn't this connector, I wasn't connecting with people. The energy I was giving off was so wrong. Now I can just be me. I don't have to pretend, I don't even have to plan. At one point in my career for over-preparing, I would deliver something that was. Yeah, I'm we kind of agreed what you're gonna ask me, but and I maybe made a few notes, but I'm we haven't asked any of those questions actually. We've just learned exactly. And so I'm like, you know what? I'm not gonna worry about over-preparing these days. I'm just, yes, I know roughly what we're gonna talk about. I made a few bullet points, but I haven't even looked at it. I'm just I've got to a point where I don't care what anybody else thinks. What I do care about is that you feel respected on the other side of the conversation. What I do care about is you can accept me for who I am. And if I say the wrong word and it's not perfect English, that's okay. You know, I've got a few hang-ups about speaking English, you know, my British boss. That's diversion. It was so brilliant. You know, when I first moved from the South Africa to the UK on a second with Unilever, he'd say, Speaking English? I'm like, yeah. He'd literally read pen my document. I mean, of course, as a South African English is not the British Queen's English, it is short, sharp, focused.
SPEAKER_01:We don't go images and sprinkle stuff. I think your message comes across even more when you do it in your most natural way with your smiles and your animation and let the feelings out. Uh, the words don't actually matter then. It's actually like you showing up. But I am gonna have to draw our conversation to a close, which is such a shame because, like I said, we didn't speak about half the things, but everything that we spoke about was powerful, and I think a lot of people will be lotting along and saying, that was me, or they will be listening and thinking, that is me. And so I hope that they listen and get some hope that there is something on the other side that they can do certain things to actually help them on the journey today, um, and whether it's recognising those triggers or being able to look in the mirror and really see who they are, getting a coach, getting a therapist, asking some really big questions like what are you hungry for? It's been genius content, brilliant, brilliant. So I just want to say thank you. Um Say a sister is all about honest conversations, and it's just like three sisters getting in the room together, which is what we absolutely did, and just that reminder that the most powerful leadership um is always in yourself and is that in that deep transformation about you know who am I, what do I want to be in this world, how do I want to show up, and that true alignment. Um, so at all times, just notice, be yourself, notice your triggers, what's working, what's not, and ask yourself some honest questions with love, kindness, and compassion because we matter, you matter, your voice matters. Um thank you so much, and I'll put all the ways to contact you and follow you on our show notes. So thank you, Rochelle.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you so much. It was awesome speaking to you, and it did really feel like sisters conversation with my sister. So thank you both.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you. That's it for this episode of Say It Sister. If it moved you, made you think, or made you even feel seen, hit follow, share it with a sister, and leave us a review.
SPEAKER_03:And remember, your voice is power and your essence is wisdom. So speak your truth and live a true and empowered life. Until next time, say it sister.
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